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purple_sky2
purple_sky2
the things i hate about sam...
May 1 2009, 9:45 AM EDT | Post edited: May 1 2009, 9:45 AM EDT
i don't like sam the much that i love dean ... sam's personality not so lovely to me ...
first his hair style: i don't like it not really , may be if he cut it shorter it would be more lovely on him .....
his way that he keep sicrets and not tell dean about it's really wired ...
in the end i like dean alot more than sam....
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vampirejediknight
1. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jul 12 2009, 10:00 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 12 2009, 10:00 AM EDT

Crazy! Sam's way cooler than Dean. He's a better person and all sorts of stuff. And what's wrong with his hair? Nothing.
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TheNiteHawke
TheNiteHawke
2. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jul 12 2009, 1:41 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 12 2009, 1:41 PM EDT
The women at the convention in LA sure seemed to like it, lol. Jensen made some remark about his hair and most of them yelled "WE LOVE HIS HAIR!" It was funny. 6  out of 12 found this valuable. Do you?    
Jenkehs
Jenkehs
3. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jul 13 2009, 2:31 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 13 2009, 2:31 AM EDT
Sam is just fantastic! his hair is his best feature :) 5  out of 13 found this valuable. Do you?    
Monii_loves_sam
Monii_loves_sam
4. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Nov 15 2009, 7:03 PM EST | Post edited: Nov 15 2009, 7:03 PM EST
as if u would say that?! sure dean is cool nd stuff but sam is way cooller nd hun dont bag his hair its the best part of him....I LOVE SAM! 5  out of 10 found this valuable. Do you?    
fierce_huntress
fierce_huntress
5. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Nov 16 2009, 3:50 AM EST | Post edited: Nov 16 2009, 3:50 AM EST
Sure it's annoying that Sam was hiding stuff, hey me as a big fan of Sam was mad at him for his behaviour in Season 4, but I just love his personality! He's really my type, all geeky and cute, but when what comes to what he can fight and be tough.

And his hair is THE BEST!!! Seriously if he cut his hair off I'd start mourning.
It wouldn't look good on him, he has a big nose and a high forehead, if he cut it off it just would look bad. Dean on the other hand with long hair would be ew, just watch the season 3 bloopers lol.
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SuperZu
SuperZu
6. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Nov 16 2009, 4:29 AM EST | Post edited: Dec 16 2010, 5:43 PM EST
OK, ladies, no fighting! Please...ha ha ha!

I know I've written this on here somewhere before, but here goes: I've always been a Dean girl, but Sammy's definitely growing on me this season. Big time! I think it's because he grew out of that "all arms and legs" phase into a super hunk, plus he shed the whining from season 3 and the conniving from season 4 ... and he's such an adorable puppy now! Yeah, it does help that at least his hair is not falling in his eyes anymore or curling up behind his ears, hee hee!

So now, there's really nothing I hate about Sam! (Why am I on this thread? ha!) I guess I have become like robinv ... bi-bro!

Oh, no Dean, don't fret ... you will always have my heart! *g*
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Lilavivat
Lilavivat
7. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Nov 18 2009, 1:42 AM EST | Post edited: Nov 18 2009, 1:42 AM EST

As for Sam's appearance, I like to compare his photos from first and fourth (or fifth) season.
On these first photos he is still a boy, almost grown-up, but still boy. That is how I see him.
Now he is definitely a man! :D Even his face has changed...

As for behaviour, I am SO glad he stopped to have secrets...
And I understand fans who like limp!Sam, it is cute, but I prefer new version of Sam - mature and strong.
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JessieGale
JessieGale
8. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Dec 16 2010, 6:59 AM EST | Post edited: Dec 16 2010, 6:59 AM EST
Wow I do not understand how anyone can like Sam better than Dean... Sam is SUCH an ungrateful douche-bag, Dean has done everything for him over the years, sacrificed so much & how does Sam repay him? He lies & connives & constantly throws Deans love back in his face. Even now he is keeping secrets & acting generally shady, like when he let Dean get captured by vamps. Not cool. And when he tried to kill Bobby. Also not cool.

I'll always be a Dean girl; he is a total bada**, but at the same time he has a good heart, not to mention being super good looking.
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Darun_Zahn
Darun_Zahn
9. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Dec 16 2010, 5:25 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 16 2010, 5:25 PM EST
OK, this thread is completely not meant for me and some of you know that. While it may be viewed that I am looking for a fight...some of what I read "be fightin words" to me :P
Aesthetically we all have our preferences so I won't bother to comment on how Sam looks since it is all opinion and no fact. What I will address is the fact that Sam has his reasons for keeping secrets. I won't excuse his secrets or some of his actions, but I understand them and for many of his decisions would have done the same thing myself.
First I'll point out what the show has pointed out that Sam in Season 6 up until now has not been Sam. He is soulless and has no idea of right and wrong and no care for anyone but himself because of his instincts. I can't lay it out any simpler than that... RoboSam was many things. He was efficient, intelligent, logical, self-serving, but of all these things he was not Sam. Even RoboSam himself considered himself to not be Sam.
Sam in season 4 was not a good side of Sam. He was driven by revenge and I think also a desire to prove that he wasn't a monster. Everything he did was done for what he thought was for a better cause. He subjected himself to a harmful substance that he hated for being in him (See season 2 for proof). He lied to Dean because lying to everyone, especially family, has been part of his life all along, he was unsure of his own actions, he knew Dean would never accept his decision to hurt himself for a cause even if he thought it was a good cause, and because Dean has always mistrusted/despised anything supernatural and Sam was utilizing one of those things (I think Dean's hatred for Ruby also played a part since she duped both the brothers into thinking she could help Dean get out of the deal when she couldn't and I think Dean took that really hard, which he should have.)
While I am tempted to say some things about Dean I'll save that ammo for later.
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SuperZu
SuperZu
10. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Dec 16 2010, 5:52 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 16 2010, 5:52 PM EST
Great points, DZ ... and they kind of made me think about some people I know in RL, and brought up this question:

So, a person can have their inner self that you know (or believe) to be really good, but can take actions, maybe over a long period of time, that are really not that great, and people might say "Oh but that's not really who he is inside." The question is, when does that person stop being who he seemed to be and begin being the person they have become? What defines us as people -- is it not our actions?

Yes, I totally agree that the first half of season six should probably NOT be part of the discussion when considering this question in terms of who Sam really is.

It's kind of a fuzzy logic thing -- you know, like when you eat an apple, when does it stop being an apple and become a core. (I have always loved that analogy!) :D

Or like cops who go deep undercover and end up doing really nasty things in their "fake" lives.

Just asking ... !
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Destielsam18
Destielsam18
11. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Dec 18 2010, 5:07 AM EST | Post edited: Dec 18 2010, 5:07 AM EST
I thin Sam and Dean are both great. Sa can get annoying but still love him. And Sam's hair is what makes Sam, Sam. But I think that without Sam it wouldnt be Supernatual without him. 2  out of 3 found this valuable. Do you?    
Darun_Zahn
Darun_Zahn
12. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jan 12 2011, 5:34 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 12 2011, 5:34 PM EST
Good question SuperZu! Sorry for the delay, but I rely on my e-mail to notify me of responses and for some reason it has just today let me know of your response.

I don't really see it that a person has multiple selves and that their inner self is good or evil or (most likely) a mixture of both and their outer self could be something different, but rather that it is all part of the same person. As a fake example, let's say I am at home and I wake to a sound. I investigate with knife in hand and find a man attempting to harm or rape my sister. Seeing an opportunity I stab and kill the man and my sister gets cut, but not horribly injured, because of the combat. Now my inner self was thinking and feeling many things. I was would be thinking, I have to stop him, I have to protect my sister, and somewhere in my head I would know that this person I am attacking is a person as well and probably has loved ones. I am probably feeling scared for my sister, angry at the attacker, and horrified by the situation. Now my action has effects, some good, some bad. My sister is saved from being raped by this man and possibly very badly hurt by him, also though my sister got cut and I killed a person. While many would agree the action is itself acceptable or a "good" thing, it doesn't change some of the negative consequences. The bad things that happened can be seen as an acceptable evil. My sister being cut is minor in comparison to rape and potential murder. The man being killed is in itself a tragedy, but acceptable seeing as his choice in actions was evil. So my outer self would be considered generally good (though really it is a good action with some gray involved). More important to me than the actions goodness or evilness is the persons inner self. My intentions, my emotional response, etc. Now an emotional response is something we can't control.... CONT!
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Darun_Zahn
Darun_Zahn
13. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jan 12 2011, 5:44 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 12 2011, 5:44 PM EST
...When people say that someone is inherently good or evil, the closest I can come to agreeing with them is by saying that by our growth our emotions act differently and uncontrollably. We can't control when we get angry or when we feel love, but what we can control is our outward response of those emotions. The intentions are vitally important though. If my intent in the fake scenario was that I "finally had a chance to see what it feels like to kill a person and get away with it" Then I think that intention makes the overall action far more vile and evil. The fact that I did it to save my sister makes it more of a good action. Though everyone has conflicting emotions and I would say it is evil to kill a person out of anger, but that was not my main emotion or intent so in then end I see people as neither good, or evil, but rather gray.
Also the reverse is true. If a maniacal person has the desire to kill random people but contains that desire and manages it, then I find that act, to be good, though it is heavily tainted with evil. I'm sure there have been times we all felt in a moment of passion we would like to throttle someone, but we contain ourselves.
So to me a persons inner self nor outer actions make them good or evil, but rather the combined effect. Sam took an evil action of lying to his brother and used that to help save others, though he also did it all in a plight for revenge against Lilith. I am not saying Sam chose the saintly route, but rather that the saintly route does not exist and all people have to contend with the fight between good and evil, and in a way, maybe that's why God (in mythology or religion) might consider humans to be greater than angels. I love the show because these are realistic people that have to choose good and evil things making Sam sometimes make mistakes an Dean sometimes make mistakes. They are both human, and I applaud the show for that.

I hope that answers your question Zu
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SuperZu
SuperZu
14. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jan 13 2011, 3:44 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 13 2011, 3:44 AM EST
Nice!

It wasn't really a question to be answered, but more of a discussion opener, and that it accomplished! Go Darun!

Those are some very interesting and related points. We all are capable of both "good" and "evil" actions as well as intentions, and both actions and the intentions behind them are important. So, what I was saying added another dimension to that, and that's the progress over time (whether self-directed or due to uncontrollable circumstances) of both intentions and actions. In other words, being led down a path that changes a person (like the examples I gave in my previous post).

As far as Sam goes, I think you're right that he did have good intentions, at least at fist. But I also think he seemed to talk himself into (or let himself be convinced) that he could do very detrimental things in the name of a greater good. These are the rationalizations that wars and treason and genocide are born of ...

Anyway, we've had a major wrench thrown in -- just as Sam seemed to be truly repenting and making up for those past betrayals (and, you know, saving the world and all, lol), he loses his soul. I don't think anything Sam's done in season 6 can be clocked toward his general demeanor. Does anyone think so?

I can't wait to see what happens next -- the rest of season 6 should reveal a lot about where Sam is now ... though I'm leery about the "damaged soul" part. We'll see.
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Darun_Zahn
Darun_Zahn
15. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jan 14 2011, 2:34 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 14 2011, 2:34 PM EST
Glad you enjoyed my rambling Zu! :)
Indeed, the part where it is over time is very important too. I need to think more on that part of it because while I have a good grip on my philosophical take on a persons actions when it is only focused on one moment on time, I don't know that I'm confident in my thoughts towards a gradual "change."
I use change in quotation marks for a specific reason though. I believe that as we live we are constantly changing. Sometimes the changes are small and almost unnoticeable, sometimes the changes can be large and dramatic. The large and dramatic changes are the ones people notice. Sam's changes are gradual since the Pilot, the same with Dean's. Just being around each other again have caused them to affect the other persons change. Sam becomes slowly more like Dean and Dean slowly more like Sam. Those subtle changes are only noticeable later when the change seems dramatic when other people just start to notice it. Sam's change in attitude when he was on demon blood, or Dean's change when he started pining for the apple pie life, these are the dramatic changes we can notice. So unlike Doctor Gregory House, who thinks that people are always generally the same person, I believe the opposite that it is nearly impossible to know everything about others and yourself because even learning something about yourself will change you slightly. That was a little off topic.
Right now my opinion on the change over time is that it's just a culmination of the person's actions that make them good or evil rather than a change that happens to the person to make them good or evil, or more so either way. As far as someone leading that person to do good or evil things goes I cannot hold that against the person. I don't blame Dean for breaking the first seal because he wasn't aware that what he was doing did that and I don't blame Sam for breaking the last seal for the same reason
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Darun_Zahn
Darun_Zahn
16. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Jan 14 2011, 2:57 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 14 2011, 2:57 PM EST
I do hold Sam responsible for trusting Ruby over Dean and lying to Dean just as I hold Dean responsible for breaking under torture and torturing other souls and enjoying it. While accidents need redeeming, I don't think it made Sam more evil to accidentally break the last seal. Ruby may have led him to do bad things that he did for the greater good and while some of those were evil-ish they also had good qualities. The fact that it was all to an evil end was accidental on his part and makes Ruby very evil for her deception. I don't yell at my nephew for accidentally spilling milk, but I do expect him to help clean it up, that's a lot less messy of a thing than what Dean and Sam have done, but I think the principle still holds.
I'll get back to you though if I think of anything else about the time factor. I may need to have a small list of things of things you consider Sam to have done that he convinced himself of that were detrimental or evil. I can see the mass quantities of demon blood being bad for him, but I respect his martyr-like ideal in that and I think the nurse he bled dry was unfortunate, but Dena and Sam ultimately kill demons and if someone gets hurt in the process then it's a sad thing, but something they have shouldered as necessary and I can see the necessity of it. They are in a constant, no-holds-bar war with demons and sometimes there will be collateral, but during the war is no time to let your grief strike you, it is after the war that I see Sam and Dean having a very hard time with all the people that have gotten hurt.
You know my standing on Soulless Sam not being Sam, so I'll leave it at that. I do however think that if or when Sam does remember what RoboSam has done he will feel guilty about it even if no one blames him but himself.
I am excited about Season 6 and can't wait to see more especially now that Sam is back! Jim Beaver has said that he is excited too.
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cindylp62
17. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Dec 21 2011, 7:59 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 21 2011, 7:59 PM EST
he's annoying and is horrible toDean(who I adore) Even in the season 7 i find him unpleasant.... They really need to make his personality at least a little more sympathetic, he seems so self centered.... 4  out of 9 found this valuable. Do you?    

VerryWhite
18. sam is cool quit being haters.
Dec 21 2011, 9:29 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 21 2011, 9:29 PM EST
what would it be without him. dean is so egocentric and self centered. still his character is the ****. but sam has demon blood in him. what do you have? there brothers. *** off. there supernatural. hahahaha. im just wondering these guys like to go to the bar "especially dean" why dont he smoke a cigerette?". none the less love the show and both characters. SMOKE ACIG DEAN!! 3  out of 3 found this valuable. Do you?    

superpinkyboo
19. RE: the things i hate about sam...
Dec 24 2011, 2:47 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 24 2011, 2:47 PM EST
Sam or dean Sam or dean? Who cares both are HOT! They are both amazing actress, I watch one little clip and now Iv seen everyone so far Iv just started from season 1 again cuz it's that good, how can anyone chose just one of the lads wen really wouldn't it be better with both :) 3  out of 3 found this valuable. Do you?    
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