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I LOVE the episodes when we get to see John! I love watching JDM, and his chemistry with Jensen and Jared is remarkable. This episode has always made me wonder exactly when John knew the details of Azazel’s plans for Sam. If John knew he’d need the Colt, then he must’ve known about Azazel’s power level and what it would take to kill him, I think. So he must’ve known the full plan – especially since it seems like only a small amount of time passed between this episode and Salvation/Devil’s Trap. And when John sees Azazel in “In My Time of Dying”, he admits that he’s known about the demon’s plan “for a while”. Unless he was lying, I’m pretty sure he knew when this episode took place.
I can’t help thinking back to the BTS comedic video we saw of Jensen and Jared playing in the snow in between scenes (at Elkins’ cabin) while filming this episode. I’m always encouraged that they seemed to have so much fun making this show. Even when I’m not happy with the show, it makes me very happy for them whenever I’m reminded of that.
Plot holes? In this episode, John says he thought vampires were extinct, and Dean and Sam both say John never mentioned vamps to them. But by season 2, vamps are suddenly commonplace when the brothers run into Gordon Walker, who hunts them regularly. When John shows Dean a vampire fang, Dean says “It’s a vamp fang” like he’s seen one before, which is impossible if he never knew they existed before this episode. The boys also seem pretty comfortable hunting vamps (in season 2) after a single encounter with John in this episode. Also, in season 3 vampires can hear a human heartbeat from blocks away, but the Winchesters somehow sneak into the nest TWICE undetected. The first time, they didn’t even bother to mask their scent.
Speaking of vampires, I like how this episode used eye flare to reveal the vampires. It’s less cheesy than showing us their fangs all the time.
This episode had some of the best family “moments” in season 1. John’s anecdote about the college funds that got spent on ammo, the discussion at the end when John acknowledges that they’re stronger as a family, etc. Those moments hit all the right tones.
kate
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This episode has always made me wonder exactly when John knew the details of Azazel’s plans for Sam. If John knew he’d need the Colt, then he must’ve known about Azazel’s power level and what it would take to kill him, I think. So he must’ve known the full plan – especially since it seems like only a small amount of time passed between this episode and Salvation/Devil’s Trap. And when John sees Azazel in “In My Time of Dying”, he admits that he’s known about the demon’s plan “for a while”. Unless he was lying, I’m pretty sure he knew when this episode took place.
WOW – interesting, kate. I NEVER had that thought at this point. How do you think John would have found out about the details? Maybe I just never really thought about (shame on me) WHY/HOW John knew that Sam had the potential of turning into something that Dean might have to kill. IF John knew here already what was to come it would make extra sense, of course, that he would like to keep the boys out of the fight and out of direct line of sight of Azazael. On the other side something as powerful as YE probably couldn’t be kept from Sam, if that’s who he needed to fulfill his plan, no matter what John did.
It’s a very plausible argument that John might have known here already….
Thanks for pointing that out, Kate.
PNP
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“How do you think John would have found out about the details?”
Great question, PNP! When the series started, nobody even knew the “thing” that had killed Mary was a demon. Then suddenly, after 22 years of searching for answers, John told Sam a few episodes ago that it was a demon. And by the first episode of season 2, not only has John identified the demon by name AND discovered a way to kill it, but he’s somehow discovered the demon’s plans for Sam, and admits that he’s known the plan “for a while”. That’s a mighty steep learning curve, even for someone with John Winchesters superhuman hunting skills.If I had to guess, I think once John figured out the “thing” was a demon, he figured out how to trap and interrogate demons, so maybe some of them gave up the information. It seems that all the demons in seasons 1 – 3 knew that Sam was supposed to lead Azazel’s army. That would’ve been a juicy piece of information to torture John with. The demons probably had fun telling John, because at that point they were pretty sure there was nothing he could do to stop the plan.
If I had to guess, that would be my best guess 🙂
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I’m SO with you, kate!! I love this one, too.
The long awaited real family reunion. Seeing them actually work together on a case. It was as thrilling the first time around as it is on the um-teenth rewatch! And it was testosterone overload….lol.
It really gives us the first more in-depth look into their head on family dynamic. That ONE scene on on the dark highway when Sam cuts John off in the Impala and they get right in each other’s faces duking it out tells us more about their history and current state of affairs than any long exposition would. I love that. I could feel for EACH of them in that scene. I feel Sam’s frustration over being shut out again, John’s anger over losing control of them in a way, Dean’s desperation to keep his family together and being forced to step between them – all clearly showing us what many fights in the Winchester “household” would have looked like And it’s all brilliantly written and acted and really gets under my skin each time watching it.I, too, love the college fund/amo scene in the cabin between John and Sam. I had high hopes that they were actually bonding in a real and maybe permanent way when we hear John admitting that he became more their drill sergeant than their dad along the way in the wake of Mary’s death, but then later he goes right back to giving the boys orders.
I also loved that in this episode Dean finally makes a first real step to standing up to John by calling him out on his crap and not just following orders blindly. It was like Dean took the words out of my brain. John had no issue sending them off on dangerous hunts alone all this time, but now he basically tells them that they are in his way again. I do get John’s counter argument that he can’t watch his boys die, BUT sending your boys on hunts alone could get them dead too….so it’s ok as long as you don’t have to WATCH? NOPE, John….that’s BS and weakly argued. You can’t have it both ways. You trained them to be killers, hunters, soldiers, smart and resourceful….now trust YOUR training them and let them participate.
Sorry, rant over. I loved that there was so much unpacked in this episode and by the end they are all in a better – more cohesive place for it.
I completely agree with the plot hole! HAHA, it was practically a fishnet stocking. But we forgive them.
I do love that they introduced (and stuck with all these years) the dead man’s blood lore!!! That was a cool idea and unique in vampire lore as far as I know.
Jared plays the choking, suffocating victim well! They love putting Sam in that position, huh?
LOVED the special effects of the first ever COLT bullet used! The skeleton shining through the skin, the flickering and the shadow being pulled out of the vamp! Nice and dramatic. Shame they didn’t keep that.
PNP
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“LOVED the special effects of the first ever COLT bullet used! The skeleton shining through the skin, the flickering and the shadow being pulled out of the vamp! Nice and dramatic. Shame they didn’t keep that.”
YES! That was pretty cool!! I wonder if they used different visual effects for Azazel and his son because they were demons, so killing one of them should look different than killing a vampire?? Now, this time through, I’ll have to pay closer attention to the visual and special effects they use when a demon gets the gank with the Colt 🙂
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I can’t help thinking back to the BTS comedic video we saw of Jensen and Jared playing in the snow in between scenes (at Elkins’ cabin) while filming this episode. I’m always encouraged that they seemed to have so much fun making this show. Even when I’m not happy with the show, it makes me very happy for them whenever I’m reminded of that.
I remember that, too, K!
Actually I also think Jensen and Jared talk about that on the episode commentary on the DVD!! Which is part of why I love watching episodes with commentary….all the BTS stories.PNP
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I love this one for how action-filled it is. It’s great that we start to see monsters as something other than “just” monsters. They have a story – how old they are, how they have partners and a “clan”.
I LOVE LOVE LOVE how smart all the Winchesters are here. This episode did such a good job of showing how truly better and smarter they are with the three of them together. Dean’s right to side with Sam (LOVE THAT MOMENT when he defies John!) and point that out. It’s true. They don’t stick to the script (John’s plan) and it saves his life.
The scene with John and Sam discussing the college fund is SO SO SO SO SO good! Made John so much more caring and human, though he blew the money on ammo which somehow DOES manage to be funny after that whole speech. Jared there…God, tears in his eyes as he sees his dad in a different light; tears my heart out. Jensen’s such a perfect actor that I don’t give Jared enough credit sometimes. He was perfect here.
Kate; they sure did do a lot of sneaking around the nest undetected! Dean even slammed open that lock on the victim’s cage with the crowbar (looking gorgeous while he did it!) and they didn’t wake up which I found very unlikely!!!!
It DOES seem like there is not much time between this one and the one where John dies…and he tells Dean then that something is up with Sam. I highly doubt he figured all that out when he learned that Sam was having visions, but I never thought about how or what he might know about Sam…and if he WAS worried about what Sam could become…how was he okay having Dean out there hunting with him alone all that time post-Stanford? Unless it was John’s plan all along for Dean not to have Sam to help him, but to be there to “watch” Sam and make sure he didn’t go off the rails.
UGH; my heart breaks for Dean. The one person he loves most in the world and he’s instructed that he might have to kill him at the start of S2! Worse yet, HE’LL have to determine when/if he kills his own brother!
Oh yes, PNP; LOVED Sam cutting off John and getting in his face and Dean just sort of standing there and you could SEE him HATING it. Hating the arguing.
The double-take that Sam does when Dean first says “Sam’s right” in defiance of John is GLORIOUS – like it just renewed his faith in himself to have “good soldier son Dean” take his side. I loved that so much!
I thought John’s first firing of the Colt was PERFECT too. The ACTING! I mean, you can see how he can’t wait to try it out; to see if it works; to give him hope that maybe it can, in fact, have the power to kill the demon he’s been hunting for years. Then the smug satisfaction on his face when it WORKS. SUCH a great JDM scene!
I have still, never in all these years watched any of the BTS or the commentary aside from catching the gag reels on YouTube. I REALLY REALLY have to do that. I’d love it.
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“I have still, never in all these years watched any of the BTS or the commentary aside from catching the gag reels on YouTube. I REALLY REALLY have to do that. I’d love it.”
Hey, Sister! You pick ANY commentary from ANY season DVD, and we can have a whole separate discussion thread just about that! A few of them are “meh”, but most of them are REALLY good! They’re one of my favorite things about the DVDs.
kate
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