Let’s all talk about Lucifer Rising (S4 E22)

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    • journalbookbinder
        September 12, 2022 at 4:58 pm #18359

        Season 4 finale. The coming of Lucifer and the end of Ruby. Which feels weird because Ruby just seemed like such a bigger part of this show and I can’t believe she was gone at the end of S4. And then…the mysterious relocation to an airplane which always bugged me a bit, but I’ll re-watch and see what I think this time around!

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      • PigNaPoke
          September 12, 2022 at 4:58 pm #20110

          LOVE Bobby’s speech at the beginning!!! Yes, Dean is tired and has all the right to be hurt by what Sam’s done, but Bobby’s right….no time for self-pity, when Sam needs help more than ever. And I can’t believe Dean would’ve truly given up on Sam.

          Ah, the beautiful room! Funny reference on “Suite Life of Zach and Cas” BEFORE Kim joined the cast. HAHA
          It’s interesting that Zach has not yet learned the lesson and still underestimates Dean telling him too much, really. He should know by now that the Winchesters always find a way through – or in this case out. Really shows the angels’ arrogance.

          I always LOVED the way the room changes when Zach reveals what’s really going on is all out. The lighting the décor the hues – it’s really well done.

          I still think THE voicemail should have been addressed at some point. Dean means what he says here and Sam never hears it! That’s so wrong.

          That actress playing the nurse-demon sure can scream!

          I’ve always been really happy that Sam struggles all along the final road with his doubts, that he isn’t just Robo Sam going for glory. Until the damn voice mail pushes him over the edge.

          The scenes between Dean and Zach and then Dean and Cas are SO GOOD – all around.

          I loved the choice they made in having Dean being forced to TALK it out – with Zach to figure things out and with Cas to convince him to help – and not fight in order to get out of the room.

          Of course, I’m happy that Cas came around to Dean’s side, but it is a little fast after he just screwed them over. I would have liked to see a little more doubt from Cas or for us to know WHERE he found out about Lilith BEING the last seal. His quick back and forth between being on the Winchester’s side then on Heaven’s side and then back with the Winchesters just shows him to be scarily immature and too easily influenced.

          Very funny if short involvement of Chuck in this one, too! Ordering phone sex because he knows the apocalypse is starting is hilarious. And I love how he put the hand on Cas’ shoulder and then takes is away when Cas stares at him.

          However, I always wondered how Cas got out of the situation with whichever Archangel was coming to save Chuck?

          VERY satisfying to see the Winchesters kill Ruby!

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        • journalbookbinder
            September 12, 2022 at 4:58 pm #20218

            Now, SERIOUSLY DAMN CAS! He knew how to temporarily stop Zachariah. He knew heaven’s plan was not to have Dean kill Lilith but just to take him out of the game to let Sam break the final seal. And THEN he sides with Dean too late. Cas is a serious fuck-up.

            I loved the talking-to Bobby gave Dean. About first insulting John and then complimenting Dean by saying Dean is a better man than John ever could be. Jensen plays that to perfection in his expressions in response to Bobby without many words. Anger at Bobby insulting John, then disbelief that Bobby thinks Dean is a better man than his father.

            I loved Dean’s swearing an oath to God like “blah blah blah whatever”. Doing it only so Sam didn’t have to (he thought).

            So I guess it was Ruby that changed Dean’s voicemail to Sam? The last straw that pushed Sam to do it? I thought it was the angels insuring the plan went forward, but the smirk Ruby gave made me think it was her.

            HER final speech after we think maybe we can somewhat trust her after all this time is jarring; like she’s so proud of herself for figuring out how to set Lucifer free and she kind of wants Sam to acknowledge how great she did!

            All the “beautiful room” (i.e. “super-gaudy room”!!!) were really good. The disappearing door. The self-healing walls. Dean referring to it as the (Star Trek) holodeck; loved all that. Dean slowly figuring it out and Dean’s speech to Cas about what’s really important; the gritty day-to-day of humanity, family, the emotions of love and pain; it’s a GREAT speech! How he just completely (in a very calculated way) dismissed Cas at the end of it and thinks maybe he lost him since Cas disappears – only to reappear and help Dean.

            Loved how Dean kept wanting to just talk to Sam; the only thing he wanted when he was offered anything…except that. Thinking he’d patch things up before he (Dean) died at Lilith’s hands probably, at first. Until he realized what was really going on.

            That short scene with Chuck WAS great; especially him putting his hand on Cas’ shoulder after Cas said he’d fight off all the archangels…only to take it away when Cas didn’t welcome that hand!

            Making LILITH the last seal (she wasn’t breaking the last seal) was good; I remember that from the first time I saw this episode and thought it was clever.

            I also remember being a bit shocked on first watch when Sam’s eyes went black…but it makes sense that perhaps he had to become part-demon to do that; though, according to Ruby, it wasn’t the blood at all; it was what was IN him…so Sam has something evil and dark in him that he choose to tap into. But do we believe ANYTHING Ruby says? Do we believe he could fly all along, Dumbo, (very old Disney reference!) and didn’t need the feather?

            At least Sam knows now that Dean did not give up on him (even if he believed the harsh voicemail was from Dean). At least Dean got to kill Ruby while Sam held her for him AND Dean got to twist the knife AND Ruby never got to see her big dream for Lucifer realized. Now, I do NOT love what they do with the opener of season 5 – how Sam and Dean are magically spirited away from danger (and if I remember right, we don’t learn how that happened for awhile?). Anyway, good “oh shit” ending to this arc. Poor Sam; did it all in the name of saving the world when both he AND Dean are just pawns to the angels’ plan – Dean unknowingly broke the first seal and Sam broke the last…while thinking he was preventing breaking the last.

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          • PigNaPoke
              September 12, 2022 at 4:58 pm #20242

              YES, DAMMIT, Cas!
              Many fans won’t let any blame come to Cas….ever….but if you look at his actions throughout the series he has MANY moments where he is not only NOT loyal to the Winchesters but actually ACTIVELY screwing them over. Some of his actions cause some of the most hurtful and dangerous situations to the Winchesters. He is often so misguided and instead of leaning on the Winchesters for advise or help he has a definite streak of hubris that is neither helpful nor becoming. HA! Another flawed dick angel.

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            • PigNaPoke
                September 12, 2022 at 4:58 pm #20246

                I think it’s Zach who changed the voicemail to Sam! When he talks to Dean and says that he has nudged Sam in the right direction (paraphrasing) to make sure he fulfills his role and I think he means the voicemail.
                (It ALWAYS bugged me that they never addressed that at any time afterwards and cleared the air about it!)

                I never liked the Dumbo reference from Ruby! It was misplaced imo and that movie is SO HORRIBLE I didn’t want it to have any place in SPN.

                VERY GOOD point about Sam seeing by Dean’s action that he hasn’t given up on him! It honestly never occurred to me. I always thought Sam would assume Dean is just there to do the job. Sam looks SO devastated and sad at the end when he says he’s sorry, like he doesn’t think there is forgiveness for his mistake. But maybe he gained hope back now that Dean was there.

                It’s an awful situation with one brother betting on the angels and the other betting on a demon in their desperation to do prevent Lucifer’s rising and BOTH being wrong in their choices and get fucked over in the process.
                I still remember thinking (after watching it the first time) that NOW Sam and Dean will understand that they are best TOGETHER counting on each other….Well….that took a while longer. LOL

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            Let’s all talk about Lucifer Rising (S4 E22)

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